Brent Posted February 18, 2008 Share Posted February 18, 2008 Dr. G, I have read on some forums where posters swear by paint decontamination. Some say they do it as often as once a year. The two most popular brands seem to be Finish Kare's line up or Automotive International's ABC line. What is your opinion on paint decontamination? Any brands you like more than others? Thanks as always Dr. G. Brent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doctor G Posted February 22, 2008 Share Posted February 22, 2008 Dr. G, I have read on some forums where posters swear by paint decontamination. Some say they do it as often as once a year. The two most popular brands seem to be Finish Kare's line up or Automotive International's ABC line. What is your opinion on paint decontamination? Any brands you like more than others? Thanks as always Dr. G. Brent Brent, Thank you for the question and I am sorry for the late reply. This has been a busy week with the new products, new labels, and a few other projects. The two systems that you mentioned are very similar if not the same. I looked at the FK1 system about 4 years ago and found it to be very aggressive for automotive paint. The first step product (#1119) is designed to soften the paint and contains petroleum solvents for that purpose. It also has TSP (tri-sodium phosphate) which is used by painters to remove soil from exterior house paint. As the instructions dictate, this should not be allowed to dry on the paint since as it dries it becomes more and more caustic and causes major paint damage. After a complete rinse to remove most of the caustic residue, the next step is applying #883 which is highly acidic and contains sulfuric acid and phosphoric acid; both of which are strong mineral acids. Again, as the instructions dictate, this should not dry on the surface either since acidity continuously increases as the water is evaporated. Also, as mineral acids are heated in warmer climates, they become more aggressive. Again the car needs to be rinsed with cold water to remove excess acid. In the last step 118SC is used as the final wash which has some mild caustic component. If I remember correctly, it contains baking soda to neutralize any remaining acid. Metal fall out is a much bigger problem in Mexico than any where in the US. There are red spots all over the paint from iron oxide in the dust particles over there. Several weeks ago I was contacted by one of the car manufacturers to develop a product for Mexico to remove these and other contaminants from paint. Apparently the paint decontamination system they were using was not capable of removing most of the rust particles while the acid step was actually etching the paint. We developed a single product for them that removed more rust in a single application than the three steps they were using and was completely safe on paint even when it dried on the surface. We are in the final stages of testing this product. Brent I hope this sheds some light on the product that I would recommend. Thanks again for your question. David, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brent Posted February 22, 2008 Author Share Posted February 22, 2008 Brent, Thank you for the question and I am sorry for the late reply. This has been a busy week with the new products, new labels, and a few other projects. The two systems that you mentioned are very similar if not the same. I looked at the FK1 system about 4 years ago and found it to be very aggressive for automotive paint. The first step product (#1119) is designed to soften the paint and contains petroleum solvents for that purpose. It also has TSP (tri-sodium phosphate) which is used by painters to remove soil from exterior house paint. As the instructions dictate, this should not be allowed to dry on the paint since as it dries it becomes more and more caustic and causes major paint damage. After a complete rinse to remove most of the caustic residue, the next step is applying #883 which is highly acidic and contains both sulfuric acid and phosphoric acid; both of which are strong mineral acids. Again, as the instructions dictate, this should not dry on the surface either since acidity continuously increases as the water is evaporated. Also, as mineral acids are heated in warmer climates, they become more aggressive. Again the car needs to be rinsed with cold water to remove excess acid. In the last step 118SC is used as the final wash which has some mild caustic component. If I remember correctly, it contains baking soda to neutralize any remaining acid. Metal fall out is a much bigger problem in Mexico than any where in the US. There are red spots all over the paint from iron oxide in the dust particles over there. Several weeks ago I was contacted by one of the car manufacturers to develop a product for Mexico to remove these and other contaminants from paint. Apparently the paint decontamination system they were using was not capable of removing most of the rust particles while the acid step was actually etching the paint. We developed a single product for them that removed more rust in a single application than the three steps they were using and was completely safe on paint even when it dried on the surface. We are in the final stages of testing this product. Brent I hope this sheds some light on the product that I would recommend. Thanks again for your question. David, David, You mentioned you were contacted by one of the car manufacturers to develop the product for Mexico. Is this a product that you will eventually offer in the US also? If so, as early as late 2008? Also, you mentioned the products from Finish Kare were very aggressive. Based on such aggressiveness to you recommend: 1) Most people should not use such a product 2) The product should not be used very often, or 3) Feel free to use the product, just be very careful ie. don't let it dry, don't use in the sun etc.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woob Posted February 23, 2008 Share Posted February 23, 2008 Dr. G, This sounds like an innovative and groundbreaking product. What are your thoughts on Automotive International's ABC System that is OEM compliant and used internationally with all the big Auto companies? Will this product be a decontamination type unit, unlike Clay which is actually engineered to remove fallout/particles? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doctor G Posted February 24, 2008 Share Posted February 24, 2008 David, You mentioned you were contacted by one of the car manufacturers to develop the product for Mexico. Is this a product that you will eventually offer in the US also? If so, as early as late 2008? Also, you mentioned the products from Finish Kare were very aggressive. Based on such aggressiveness to you recommend: 1) Most people should not use such a product 2) The product should not be used very often, or 3) Feel free to use the product, just be very careful ie. don't let it dry, don't use in the sun etc.. Brent, We will offer this new paint decontamination product here and abroad once the formulation is finalized. As far as the Finish Care system, I would recommend using it very carefully. The first two products come with very strong warnings for good reasons. Also they should only be used if needed in my opinion. There is no reason to subject paint to harsh chemicals unless it is necessary. David, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doctor G Posted February 24, 2008 Share Posted February 24, 2008 Dr. G,This sounds like an innovative and groundbreaking product. What are your thoughts on Automotive International's ABC System that is OEM compliant and used internationally with all the big Auto companies? Will this product be a decontamination type unit, unlike Clay which is actually engineered to remove fallout/particles? Brandon, The AI & FK systems are very similar if not the same. Some OEs prefer using these chemical means to remove surface contaminants from paint while others recommend clay which works by abrasion. In Mexico the ABC system was being used to remove industrial fallout which was forming rust spots on paint. The results were less than satisfactory since it was leaving most of the rust behind while etching and damaging the paint. They had to clay the car afterwards to remove most of the rust particles. The product we sent them effectively removed rust and other contaminants and did not harm paint even if it was left to dry on the surface. This product is in the final stages of testing. David, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brent Posted February 25, 2008 Author Share Posted February 25, 2008 The product we sent them effectively removed rust and other contaminants and did not harm paint even if it was left to dry on the surface. This product is in the final stages of testing. David, When is your guesstimate of when your product will be on the market? I am looking forward to using it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
budman3 Posted February 25, 2008 Share Posted February 25, 2008 This sounds like another A+ Optimum product coming to the market. I like the sound of using a chemical on the paint and having it completely paint safe. Even professionals could miss a spot or have something come up and would accidently leave the other decom. kits on... and what a mess that would be! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anthony Orosco Posted February 25, 2008 Share Posted February 25, 2008 Ron and I have been thoroughly testing this product for some time now and so far it has worked like a charm. It is in concentrated form so it can be mixed in various strengths determined by the job at hand. We use it to remove rust, water spots from both paint and glass and we have also been using it as a clay lube which is how I use it the most. It is also best to try and dissolve away paint contaminates before resorting to abrasive means. It will be ready soon. Anthony Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woob Posted February 25, 2008 Share Posted February 25, 2008 Woob, the AI & FK systems are very similar if not the same. Some OEs prefer using these chemical means to remove surface contaminants from paint while others recommend clay which works by abrasion. In Mexico the ABC system was being used to remove industrial fallout which was forming rust spots on paint. The results were less than satisfactory since it was leaving most of the rust behind while etching and damaging the paint. They had to clay the car afterwards to remove most of the rust particles. The product we sent them effectively removed rust and other contaminants and did not harm paint even if it was left to dry on the surface. This product is in the final stages of testing. David, Amazing, thanks for the info. Can this product be used with Elastrafoam? How dangerous is it in the sun or in hot temperatures? I'm excited for this product, I was considering using the ABC system since it's raved as being OEM Compliant/Factory TSB issued. This sounds like it will further work with ONR. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smithule Posted September 18, 2008 Share Posted September 18, 2008 Any update on this product. I may be in need very soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brent Posted September 18, 2008 Author Share Posted September 18, 2008 Any update on this product. I may be in need very soon. If we haven't heard anything about it yet, I am thinking it will be 2009 before we see it on the market. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sal329 Posted September 19, 2008 Share Posted September 19, 2008 This sounds like another great product. Dr G I really look forward to this hitting the market. Thank you for all your hard work, every Optimum product I have used has just been amazing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doctor G Posted September 24, 2008 Share Posted September 24, 2008 This sounds like another great product. Dr G I really look forward to this hitting the market. Thank you for all your hard work, every Optimum product I have used has just been amazing. Thank you for your great comments. We will be offering this product for the professional detailers and the enthusiasts in the near future. Thanks again. David, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hamilton Posted September 29, 2009 Share Posted September 29, 2009 Any news on this product? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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