BradB Posted March 31, 2017 Share Posted March 31, 2017 I am dipping my foot into the world of Optimum and am finding a lot of conflicting information. As a pretty accomplished detailer, my use of Optimum is a personal experiment. I want to experience the kind of dirt and water repellency that coatings are famous for right out of the syringe, so to speak. I don't want to alter the chemistry or add another coating that would alter the look and feel (slickness/beading characteristics/water and dirt repellency) of the freshly applied Gloss Coat. So how do I QD it? How do I wash it? I know you are going to say use ONR or some Optimum QD spray but in reading the marketing descriptions, these products can be used with ANY brand or type of product. This leads me to believe they have their own beading/sheeting/dirt repellant properties that are NOT identical to the Gloss Coat. That would disappoint me. For example, I wouldn't want to use Optimum Gloss Coat and then come to realize the "lesser" XYZ quick detailer I use, which is leaving trace coverage on the surface, is what I am really seeing regarding the surface qualities. It just hit me that I never considered how to maintain an Optimum Gloss Coated car and still keep the purest form of the coating itself. Full disclosure, I am a big Zaino user and Z6 or Z8 are my go-to quick detailers and Z10 is my wash. I get amazing results with Zaino, but wanted to try something different and fully expect a different "experience". I appreciate your thoughts and suggestions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Guz Posted March 31, 2017 Share Posted March 31, 2017 ONR is always recommended. The instant gloss spray detailer leaves slickness and gloss behind. The protection these two leave behind won't last that long. The QD is great for someone who is looking to squeeze out more gloss. Some even use opti-seal as a drying aid over gloss coat. In one of the recent rag company videos, there is mention that opti-coat sheds opti-seal within a week due to the self cleaning effect. I asked if the same was true for gloss coat on the comments section and received a yes stating that it behaves the same. So go ahead and use any of these. It's all about the product synergy. I've used all of these on gloss coat and didn't notice a change in the behavior of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron@Optimum Posted March 31, 2017 Share Posted March 31, 2017 The reason Optimum suggests using our products over coatings, besides the obvious (we're a for profit business) is as Guz states, "the synergy". We KNOW our products are safe and will compliment each other. Other manufacturer's products can be used to clean, wax, seal Gloss-Coat without affecting the appearance. As Guz said, properties left by any product will not stick for long...kinda the point of coating. So try any and all maintenance products and decide for yourself what does the best job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BradB Posted March 31, 2017 Author Share Posted March 31, 2017 Guz, Ron, thanks for the quick replies. I'm starting to understand some of the differences in each Optimum product better. As in many brands, there seems to be quite a bit of overlap between products. While I understand how this creates syngery it makes it harder for me to determine which products are must-haves to make Gloss-Coat work best and which ones are beneficial, but not mandatory. But I'm slowly figuring it out. To that end, does using ONR, or Optimum Car Wash or Opti Seal or Optimum QD make Gloss-Coat "last longer"? Given your comments about Gloss-Coat shedding or not allowing other products to stick, I would guess no. It seems like all of these, in reality, are only temporary in the way they affect the surface. And while these are obviously part of the "system" and great products on their own, they don't affect the Gloss-Coat performance. I hope I got this right. In fact, while perhaps not recommended, it seems I "could" use Z6 as a QD to get rid of some dust on the paint. Since the effects of Z6 will only be temporary anyway. Same for using any shampoo, I assume. Don't grimace, I'm thinking I will get the Optimum equivalents but was wondering if my assumption was correct. I have started watching some Rag Co. videos and will look into it more, thanks. But since you brought up Opti-Seal, that's a product I don't really understand well. It's main purpose is for protection, but it doesn't last long on Gloss-Coat. So was it mainly developed for those who want protection but don't have Gloss-Coat or Opti-Coat? Guz, you do mention using it as a possible drying aid, but beyond that I'm not sure where it fits into the scheme of things. Thanks for holding my hand, guys. I'm getting there! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A&J Posted March 31, 2017 Share Posted March 31, 2017 Opti seal is a great pure sealant and a great top up for Gloss coat. It has no cleaning properties and its main function is to protect. Its also the best drying aid Ive ever used. Plus its versatile...you can use it on glass as a glass cleaner and a temporary rain repellent, as a paint sealant, wheel sealant, plastic sealant, indoor plastic protectant and probably much more. It can be used as a LSP or as a top up for coatings. Its non abrasive so it wont hurt the coating. One way of using it is an hour after you applied Gloss coat. The coating needs about a day before it can get wet and about a week before it can be washed with a shampoo. Opti seal protects the coating in that period of time against possible rain, bird bombs, etc... About Gloss coat. Think of Gloss coat as a long lasting sealant. You can wash it with whatever you want and protect it with whatever you want but to get the most of it OPT products are the way to go. If you want to check out beading from Gloss coat use a pure shampoo. OPT car wash, or any other pure shampoo will do the job. Angelwax also has one and Britemax will release their new Pure shampoo tomorrow. The thing with ONR is that it does leave some polymers behind but those are short lived (a day or two max). But note that ONR is the mildest and because of that the safest possible shampoo you can use to clean your paintwork and the coating. OPT QD, OCW and Opti Seal all add protection. Its not the longest lasting but who cares. People at the average wash their car at least once a month and if you use any of these products (you can even use products from other manufacturers - no OPT detailing police will come after you if you do ) you will add protection ontop of the coating and prolong its life on the car. Beading will change but protection is protection. BTW Gloss coat really does produce some nice beads. I was pleasantly surprised a few months after I applied it. I snow foamed and shampooed the car (not with OPT products, I hope no one is reading this) and after I PW the shampoo off I got that jaw breaking moment of how awesome Gloss coat repelled water. Truly amazing. Any more questions just fire away...I mean not literally fire away...I have to be careful with what I say to you Gun loving crazy Americans Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BradB Posted March 31, 2017 Author Share Posted March 31, 2017 Ok, ok! I'll get some Opti Seal, too. Boy, you guys are costing me a lot of money! I've probably got 30+ waxes and sealants on the shelves. I knew I should have stayed away from Optimum. Sucked in. It's a sickness. So it sounds like I can't really go wrong playing with Opti-Seal. You mentioned waiting an hour after Gloss-Coat to apply it. To be clear, you mean "anytime after" an hour, right? After an hour, the next day or next week. It isnt a minimum time window to be applied, I assume. And I might as well try some of the Optimum Car Wash, too. I think my Zaino Z10 would suffice, but it sounds like Ron is challenging me to experiment. Lol! That's what I love to do anyway. Since we we are adding to my arsenal, I have a question on ONR. In the dead of winter I use it for a waterless wash. But I prefer wasting lots of water the rest of the year. (!) But it is advertised as being able to be used as a QD. What is better, ONR diluted as a QD or Optimum Instant Detailer? I'm just wondering if there are other uses for ONR. So far I am thinking my regimen will be: Gloss Coat, occasional Opti Seal applications, wash with Optimum Car Wash, frequent quick detailing with either diluted ONR or Optimum Instant Detailer. Does this sound good? So......anything else I MUST HAVE? (Or really don't need?) Thanks for letting me rattle off questions. No worries, I am a gun-free American. Yes, they do exist! Lol! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lowejackson Posted March 31, 2017 Share Posted March 31, 2017 Brad, not used Optigloss so cannot help on that matter but as for ONR or OID, the choice is yours. OID will add more slickness and gloss but ONR would be much cheaper. As for ONR, this is a very versatile product, can be used for light cleaning on most surfaces. Great on interiors including leather, cannot compete against an APC for heavy dirt or oils but for a quick interior clean, it is great. Can be used in a steamer and wet/vac as well. I have used ONR mixed with IPA for glass cleaning although these days I tend to use ONR with a glass cloth and use a dedicated glass polish every few months. The reason for stopping using IPA with ONR was not performance based but simply I am very poor at adding labels and just have a single bottle of diluted ONR made my life easier. The Car Wash is a nice product which is often overlooked, it will not change your life but it is a gentle cleaner. There is a nice phrase from one of the Rag Company videos by Yvan, he talked about the rule of 2 for those with problems, either people are using too much product or trying too hard. I would add a third option, thinking too hard. Zaino obviously make some great products, maybe the difference between the two brands is OPT products require less effort and time to use (excluding coating application) however both brands will give great results Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Guz Posted April 1, 2017 Share Posted April 1, 2017 These two covered it very well. Opti-Seal has many uses as A&J has stated. As he mentioned, opti-seal is recommended 1 hour after the last coat of gloss coat to protect gloss coat during the 7 day curing time frame. You can technically top Gloss Coat with whatever you want. You can wax over it if you wish to. It's just not really needed. But opti-seal, instant detailer and OPT car wax will add slickness to the paint as well as gloss. Gloss Coat like most coatings are not that slick to the touch. They have that plastic/rubbery feel. Heck I have used CarPro Ech2o (QD ratio) over gloss coat with no issues. It sure did leave some nice gloss and slickness after I used it. So feel free to use what you like. These are the photos I took after an ONR wash and Ech2o QD wipedown. Gloss Coat is coming up at 9 months for me and performing like day one. In these photos Gloss Coat had been on for 6 months. Same goes for a car shampoo. You can use whichever product you like. Optimum car wash is a very nice car wash. It does have a little bit of polymers as well. Nothing significant. But it does have some of the frothiest suds of any wash I have used. I have used Meguiar's Hyper Wash and CarPro Reset as well and they do not alter the performance of gloss coat. ONR for me is just so convenient to use on a weekly basis that I rarely bucket wash these days. Part of that was because of the drought here in Southern California which forced me to go rinseless/waterless. As far as a waterless wash, I am not a fan of ONR in that regard. Feels a bit grabby for me. Same when used as a quick detailer. Instant detailer feels much better when it comes to a quick detailer due to the slickness left behind. Opti-Clean is a waterless wash and feels better than ONR as a waterless wash. Give ONR a try as a waterless wash and see if you like it. If not you always have opti-clean as an option. OPT car wax is really optional. The one reason to have it in your arsenal is when it comes to decontaminate gloss coat using the wash, clay, wax method. It's also fresh paint safe so if you happen to have a repaint you can use it safely. I have it in my arsenal. But I would recommend investing in ferrex for not only prepping the paint but also for when it comes to decontaminating the paint coating down the road. Anyway no need to overthink it. Experiment and have fun Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
No Soap Posted April 1, 2017 Share Posted April 1, 2017 Using clay must eat some of the Gloss coat? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BradB Posted April 1, 2017 Author Share Posted April 1, 2017 7 hours ago, No Soap said: Using clay must eat some of the Gloss coat? I've wondered this myself. And how durable is Gloss-Coat against other products such as chemical cleaners, solvents or light abrasives such as those in cleaner waxes? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BradB Posted April 1, 2017 Author Share Posted April 1, 2017 Guz, Thanks for the great feedback. (And those pics are impressive! ) You have me intrigued with your thoughts on the ONR and OID comparison I am getting the QD and look forward to doing a comparison myself. Your comments on claying really got me thinking. I was hopeful that Gloss-Coat would be more resistant to fallout. Not so? Stuck in my old school ways, I haven't used any ferrex product I'm embarrassed to say. I haven't felt the need. I guess I need to see proof that they are better than my own regimen of care. I'm always fearful of doing harm or degrading the finish or protective layer I have put on. Plus I am leary of "marketing" claims. That, and I am cheap! Lol! Overthinking is my middle name, can't you tell! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Guz Posted April 1, 2017 Share Posted April 1, 2017 12 hours ago, No Soap said: Using clay must eat some of the Gloss coat? Optimum recommends using optimum car wax and ONR to clay gloss coat. The reason for this is the car wax sprays on thicker than a clay lube to reduce the chance of marring as well as not impacting the performance of the coating. Very little pressure is recommended. 5 hours ago, BradB said: I've wondered this myself. And how durable is Gloss-Coat against other products such as chemical cleaners, solvents or light abrasives such as those in cleaner waxes? Cleaner waxes, compounds or polishes are not recommended. Pretty much anything with abrasives as that will remove the coating. Chemical cleaners are fine like an APC o r MDR. 4 hours ago, BradB said: Guz, Thanks for the great feedback. (And those pics are impressive! ) You have me intrigued with your thoughts on the ONR and OID comparison I am getting the QD and look forward to doing a comparison myself. Your comments on claying really got me thinking. I was hopeful that Gloss-Coat would be more resistant to fallout. Not so? Stuck in my old school ways, I haven't used any ferrex product I'm embarrassed to say. I haven't felt the need. I guess I need to see proof that they are better than my own regimen of care. I'm always fearful of doing harm or degrading the finish or protective layer I have put on. Plus I am leary of "marketing" claims. That, and I am cheap! Lol! Overthinking is my middle name, can't you tell! There is always a misconception about coatings being bulletproof. For example they are not scratch proof but rather scratch resistant. Hence they help with wash induced marring over a traditional wax or sealant. But coatings can be swirled if not properly maintained. The biggest pro is that they are more durable than a wax or sealant and offer longer protection. But like a wax or sealant, the coating will still get contaminated. That is all dependent on the area one lives in and whether the car is stored inside or outside. Too many variables. It is true that the paint will look cleaner longer and it won't get contaminated as quick as a wax or sealant. Not to mention how much better it looks as well as how easy it is to maintain. I would recommend a decon wash 1-2 times a year. Very simple to do and a good way to restore the beading and sheeting of gloss coat. Contaminants can mask those two aspects. Ferrex is paint safe so no need to worry about that. It will attack the iron fall out that has found it's way onto and into the paint. Claying removes some but not the embedded particles. That's the paraphrased version. There are a couple ways to decontaminate. The wash, clay, wax method which is the mechanical way and the chemical way. This podcast has all of that info around the 20 min mark. http://optimumsynergypodcast.libsyn.com/the-man-behind-the-lab-coat-ceo-and-chemist-dr-david-ghodoussi I highly recommend listening to the podcast. Episode 6 is a must listen. Some of the recent Q&A ones with Dr. G are good as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BradB Posted April 1, 2017 Author Share Posted April 1, 2017 Great info, Guz. I appreciate the feedback. I look forward to listening to the podcast. I didn't know they existed. Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BradB Posted April 1, 2017 Author Share Posted April 1, 2017 I just thought of another question that I might as well throw out now. Is there any problem putting a clear bra on a car coated in Gloss-Coat? I am getting a new car and will eventually get a clear bra, and will certainly put a coating on top of that. But I am not going to get it clear bra'd right away so I thought I would Gloss-Coat it for a while then add the clear bra when I can. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Guz Posted April 1, 2017 Share Posted April 1, 2017 No problem. Gloss Coat is a great coating. I've used quite a few and it's by far at the top for me in terms of overall performance and ease of application. Optimum has come out with their version of PPF film. It can go over coated paint and be coated over. With XPEL I'm 99% certain that the coating would have to be polished off so the film adheres to the paint. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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